In the second installment of this two-part interview, radio producer Steve Miller talks about his favorite jobs, what job he hated, and what made the difference. At the core of this conversation are some important questions… is it possible to do what you’re passionate about, even when it doesn’t pay the bills? Is it possible to enjoy a job that isn’t your “dream?” And what does worshiping God have to do with it all? The latest in Know Why’s Thriving at Work series, this episode is a conversation you’ll enjoy. (Listen to Part 1.)
What Makes You Love a Job?
In recalling what the varied job titles he’s held, Steve shares what make certain jobs awful, tolerable, or enjoyable. “It’s hard to say what makes you love a job,” he says. “I think it’s a combination of loving the actual work you do and loving the environment you’re in.”
That doesn’t mean you have to be working your “dream job” to be enjoy work. In fact, Steve believes it’s important to accept that for most people, desires and work aren’t always perfectly aligned.
“To find pleasure in the work that we are given to do is in itself a communion with God.”
Steve Miller
There are even some benefits to separating one’s passion—or avocation—from one’s job—vocation. For instance, burnout is more likely when the thing you’re most passionate about and the thing that pays the bills are one and the same. It can be hard to draw proper work-life boundaries.
Reject the Idea of the ‘Idealized’ Life
The idea that one’s reality must match up perfectly with their “ideal” is faulty, Steve argues. He says waiting on the “perfect” thing to come along—whether that’s the perfect job or the perfect life partner—is a recipe for misery. Instead, we should look for joy in what’s already before us.
As a Christian, Steve argues that God created humans to work and find joy in it. “To find pleasure in the work that we are given to do is in itself a communion with God,” he said.
Other Advice
To find happiness in both avocation and vocation, Steve has a few tips:
Try to find a job you’re good at and enjoy, even if it isn’t your “dream job.”
Seek counsel from others. Specifically, ask trusted people what talents and abilities they see in you.
Find a local faith community and get involved with other people. A good community—even if unrelated to your specific line of work—will refresh your soul and offer the strength you need to face whatever work is before you.
Is burnout unavoidable? With workplace stress at an all-time high, it may seem that way. But according Dr. Eddy Brewer, Senior Pastor at Capitol Hill Assembly of God in Oklahoma City, the answer is no! His studies prove it is possible to prevent burnout and cultivate a healthy work-life balance. He shares the “how”—backed by extensive research and ancient wisdom—in this episode of the Know Why Podcast, the first in our series on Thriving at Work.
A Common Problem
New research from Future Forum found in 2023 that over 40 percent of workers (of 10,000 full-time, desk-based employees in six countries) reported being burned out. Those under 30 experienced burnout at even higher rates, and were the most at risk for burning out.
This aligns with Dr. Brewer’s findings. After writing his doctoral dissertation on burnout among clergy, Dr. Brewer discovered that “the majority of burnout among ministers happens within the first five years, and the majority of that happens within the first three years.”
It’s your responsibility to give attention to your spiritual condition.”
Dr. Eddy Brewer, Capitol hill Assembly of God
In short, work-place stress is hitting young adults hard. Dr. Brewer found other information in his research that may surprise listeners. Those most likely to experience burnout are unmarried singles. Among married people, those without children are more likely to experience burnout than parents. In general, women experience more burnout than men.
Think you might be experiencing symptoms of burnout? It’s typically marked by three signs, Dr. Brewer explained: emotional exhaustion, cynicism, and a lack of personal accomplishment.
Several factors can lead to burnout, Dr. Brewer said, including “unrealistic expectations” both of your job and your own performance. Lacking identity outside of work is also a big factor. “Try to separate your identity from your work,” he said. “Get your identity from who God made you to be, not just your career.”
Preventative Measures
How can you avoid burnout? Dr. Brewer suggests five steps:
Take care of your spiritual health.
Be thankful.
Rest.
Get a hobby.
Maintain meaningful and healthy relationships.
He also recommends reading the biblical book of Psalms, even if you’re not a frequent reader of Scripture. Many of the Psalms were written by David, a figure in the Bible who experienced burnout and frequent stress. The range of emotions expressed in the Psalms will resonate with anyone experiencing burnout. David wasn’t the only biblical figure to experience burnout. On the podcast, Dr. Brewer shares stories of others in the Bible who are burned out and learn to cope through things like delegation of leadership, naps, food, and more.
More Resources
Dr. Eddy Brewer has offered to email his dissertation on burnout to anyone who requests a copy. Readers will find a detailed list of resources on the topic in the dissertation. To request a copy, email [email protected].
Ben Bennett is the Director of the Resolution Movement, a speaker, and the co-author of Free to Thrive: How Your Hurt, Struggles, and Deepest Longings Can Lead to a Fulfilling Life. In this episode of the Know Why Podcast, Ben talks with Liberty about his personal journey from struggling to thriving—and how both brain science and biblical truth offered breakthroughs.
Millennials and Gen Z: Hurting Like Never Before
In 2019, 70% of teens said anxiety and depression are major problems amongst their peers according to Pew Research Center.
In the last five years, some research has shown that young adults are 63 times more lonely than those over 75 years old.
Only 4% of Gen Z hold to a biblical worldview, and is historically the least religious generation in American history.
Suicide is a leading leading cause of death among young people.
Ben also noted that few pastors report feeling very well equipped to help people with their mental and emotional struggles. As someone raised in the Christian church, Ben felt this personally. As he began dealing with multiple mental health issues and addictions, he felt alone and thought he would struggle forever.
“I had this cocktail of compulsions trying to survive, trying to deal with life.”
Ben Bennett Resolution Movement
“I had this cocktail of compulsions trying to survive, trying to deal with life,” Ben told Know Why Podcast. “I was trying everything I was hearing from Christians at the time but it just didn’t seem to work.”
Neuroplasticity: Renewing Your Mind
What Ben details in his book Free to Thrive with co-author Josh McDowell is that often, addictions, “unwanted behaviors,” and mental health struggles are humans’ attempted solutions to fill unmet longings. Everyone has ingrained longings such as acceptance. Not getting those longings fulfilled can trigger unwanted responses.
But those responses can be overcome by creating new pathways in your brain.
“Brain scans show that through repeated thoughts and actions, changes happen in the brain. The things you used to struggle with you no longer struggle with. New pathways are grown and developed.”
Ben Bennett Resolution Movement
“I just saw anxiety in my life go down by about 90 percent,” Ben said, “And what I realized was happening was, I was being transformed by the renewing of my mind (Romans 12:2), and neuroplasticity—brain scans show that through repeated thoughts and actions, changes happen in the brain. The things you used to struggle with you no longer struggle with. New pathways are grown and developed.”
Listen to the full episode to hear Ben explain neuroplasticity more and how it helped him overcome food addiction, pornography addiction, and anxiety when the well-meaning advice of others couldn’t. Ben also challenges listeners to think differently about Christianity, even if they have experienced legitimate hurts from Christians.
“It’s not that the bad’s not bad,” he told Know Why Podcast. “It’s that the good is too good to walk away from.”
Interview with Jonathan Teague, Sr. Associate Pastor of Prestonwood Baptist Church
Gallup reported in 2021 that church membership in the United States dropped below 50 percent. This is new for Americans, who have traditionally reported high rates of church membership and attendance.
Church membership isn’t just dropping because fewer people identify as religious now. Even among people who still identify with a religion, fewer are members of churches, synagogues and mosques.
“Pew researchers concluded that people who regularly participate in religious congregations tend to be happier and more civically engaged than their peers who are infrequent attendees or don’t identify with a religion at all.”
Carol Kuruvilla, Religion Reporter HuffPost
This leads Know Why Podcast to ask the questions, does church attendance matter at all? For those who aren’t religious or church attenders—what’s missing? For those who are religious, why not worship at home?
On this episode, Liberty and Jonathan Teague, Sr. Associate Pastor of Prestonwood Baptist Church, share research that highlights several benefits of attending a house of worship. Jonathan also shares more about what a Christian church community should look like according to the Bible.
Happier in Church?
From a research standpoint, there is significant evidence revealing that those who frequent the pews are better off — and not just in the United States:
“But,” Pew found, “the analysis finds comparatively little evidence that religious affiliation, by itself, is associated with a greater likelihood of personal happiness or civic involvement.”
The social aspect of attending religious services likely plays a big part. According to Pew, “those who frequently attend a house of worship may have more people they can rely on for information and help during both good and bad times.” T. M. Luhrmann wrote for The New York Times, “At the evangelical churches I’ve studied as an anthropologist, people really did seem to look out for one another.”
“Although social activity seems to be a key driver of well-being among religiously active people, there is plenty of research to suggest that other factors play a role, too. Some researchers argue that virtues promoted by religion, such as compassion, forgiveness, and helping others, may improve happiness and even physical health if they are practiced by parishioners.”
The New York Times reported recently that with church attendance dropping in America, people are losing community that is important to humans’ health and wellbeing. That community isn’t getting replaced with secular activities, according to sociologists.
When Jonathan asks young adults what they hope to find in a church, here’s what he hears:
“More often than not, what they talk about is … being known, being loved, having a place where they can serve, having a place where they can find not only community, but identity, and finding a place where they have value and they get to participate in increasing value. And the good news is, the Scripture lends itself to all those things.”
“If you’re looking for—ideally—the friendliest, most loving, faithful place, you should find it in a church,” he added, noting that it’s up to Christians and ministers to keep those promises of what church is supposed to be according to Scripture.
And Christians often get it wrong. Jonathan notes that millennials and Gen Z don’t have a problem with the teachings of Jesus as much as they have a problem with Christians’ behavior. That’s why it’s up to Christians and ministers to keep the promises of what Christian community and churches is supposed to be.
“I think the majority of young adults, I think the majority of young millennials, they’re pretty cool with the ideas of Jesus, this whole idea of love and service and sacrifice and helping others and healing others.”
Jonathan Teague, Sr. Associate Pastor Prestonwood Baptist Church
What Does the Bible Say?
Biblical churches should be faithful, built on truth, and have members that actually care for one another, Jonathan told Know Why. And while many people believe in God without attending religious services, the Bible emphasizes church membership as fundamental part of Christian life.
“Every letter in the New Testament assumes Christians are members of local churches. … They teach us how to get along with other members, how to encourage the weak within the church, how to conduct ourselves at church, and what to do with unrepentant sinners in the church. … All these things are impossible if you aren’t a member of a local church.”
Does science conflict with the Bible? In this episode of the Know Why Podcast, Jonathan Witt, Executive Editor of Discovery Institute Press, notes that many scientists throughout history and today profess faith in God, even arguing that scientific study points to his existence.
Famous Scientists Who Were Also Religious
“The Christian worldview actually gave birth to science,” Jonathan told Know Why Podcast. The Judeo-Christian worldview prevalent in renaissance Europe “fired the imaginations and it ordered the reasoning of those that gave birth to the scientific revolution.”
In the 16th Century, Anglican thinker Sir Francis Bacon developed the scientific method, which uses experimentation and inductive reasoning to learn more about the natural world.
In the 17th Century, Galileo, a Christian, advanced groundbreaking discoveries, including that the earth revolved around the sun, and argued that science does not contradict the Bible.
“There are scientists in our age who see nature, see even recent discoveries pointing to God intelligent design, pointing to evidence of a God,” Jonathan said, mentioning Nobel Prize winning physicists Arno Penzias, 90, and Charles Townes (1915-2015) as examples.
Francis Collins, former director of the National Institutes of Health and a leading scientist in DNA research, is a current example of a prominent scientist vocal about his Christian faith.
There are plenty more examples of men and women combining faith and science throughout history and today. Modern scientists aren’t as hostile to religion as people may think. Many scientists around the world acknowledge the possibility of a spiritual realm. And the majority of people working in science-related fields are religious.
Understanding the Bible
Still, sometimes scientific discoveries seem to go against something the Bible says. That’s why it’s important to understand what the Bible is.
The Bible claims to be the true, authoritative word of God, given to human authors to write down throughout multiple centuries and locations. It contains poetry, prophecies, parables, genealogical records and historical accounts. Combined, these writings tell the story of God and his love for humanity.
The Bible never claims to be a comprehensive textbook of science or history. So when reading books within the Bible, it’s important to consider their historical, literary, and cultural context in order to interpret them correctly — something theologians have been doing (and sometimes disagreeing about) for centuries. For instance, the Bible claims that God created the universe, but even Christians often disagree about how he created it.
Where Christians will land in this debate depends on their interpretation of Genesis. Genesis is the first book in the Bible, and its first two chapters focus on creation. According to the biblical creation account, God created the universe in six days, with man being his final creation.
Theistic evolutionists argue the story of creation is meant to be symbolic or allegorical — that the six days of creation actually represent ages of time during which evolution took place under God’s guidance. Others, called creationists, hold that the story of creation is literal. They believe the six days of creation were actually six 24-hour days, and that God created all living things by speaking them into existence.
As Jonathan acknowledged on Know Why, “Whereas God is infallible and his Word is infallible, our understanding of Scripture is not necessarily infallible.”
